Tales of Leadership
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Tales of Leadership
#102 John Troxell - Retired SEAC, U.S. Army
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John Troxell is a retired U.S. Army Command Sergeant Major who served nearly 38 years in uniform. He held the position of Senior Enlisted Advisor to the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff (SEAC), serving as the senior non-commissioned officer in the entire U.S. military. Known for his energy, authenticity, and selfless service, John continues to lead through mentorship, public speaking, and writing.
Connect with John Troxell
- New Book: Read Here
- LinkedIn: John Troxell
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Introducing a Transformational Leader
Speaker 1You're listening to the Tells the Leadership podcast . This podcast is for leaders at any phase on their leadership journey to become a more purposeful and accountable leader what I like to call a pal . Join me on our journey together towards transformational leadership . All right team , welcome back to the Tells the Leadership podcast . I'm your host , josh McMillian , an active duty Army officer and Army leadership coach .
Speaker 2The founder of McMillian Leadership Coaching , but , most importantly , I am on a mission to end toxic leadership by promoting transformational stories and skills .
Speaker 1And on today's episode I am bringing you a transformational leader , john Wayne Troxell . A transformational leader , john Wayne Troxell . He is the retired senior enlisted advisor to the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff command sergeant major for the Army , has served over 38 years , a published author of Surrender or Die and , at the end of the day , just a patriot , someone who is still giving back in service to this country .
Speaker 2And we go through his journey and really pull out some of the key lessons learned and wisdom points that has set him up for success , not only in his 38-year career , by the way , achieving the highest rank that you can as a senior noncommissioned officer but what he's doing now and he's still full of purpose . And here's two tools for you . Number one stay to the end or go to the end , and I'll provide you the top three takeaways from this episode that I pulled from , but I would also love to hear what yours are . But number two you can go to mcmillianleadershipcoachingcom and you can read the blog article that is associated with this episode , and it is all distilled down with the key points . And I do all this for free to you guys , so you can go be the best leader possible and make a difference in this world , Be the leader that this world needs . Let's go ahead and bring John on . John , it still feels weird for me to say that . Welcome to the Tales of Leadership podcast . How are you doing ?
Speaker 3Hey , I'm doing good , Joshua , how are you ?
Speaker 2I can't complain A lot of these because I'm still an active duty service member , so running a podcast is a challenge . So I'm still kind of in my duty uniform for the day , so I'm doing well .
Speaker 3Hey , thanks for having me . It's an honor to be here with you .
Speaker 2The first place that I would always love to kind of just to start with is you really need no introduction , but could you provide an overview to the listeners of who you are ?
Speaker 3Yeah , my name is John Wayne Troxell . I spent one month shy of 38 years on active duty in the United States Army . I was a 19 Delta Calvary Scout , spent the vast majority of my career in airborne units and striker units , five combat tours , to include the combat jump into Panama in 1989 , desert Shield , desert Storm , a couple of times in Iraqi Freedom and Enduring Freedom , and I culminated my career as the senior enlisted advisor to the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff , which is the senior enlisted person in the Department of Defense , and I did that from 2015 to 19, . Retired in 2020 . And now I am some call me a serial entrepreneur . I have my own consulting company . I consult for various businesses , I am a published author and I have my own leader development company with a good friend of mine , a former Air Force JTAC , tim Chachi Pachesa , and I do a lot of stuff . That keeps me busy , but it also allows me to pay it forward to the current force and give back to my fellow veterans .
Speaker 2So , in a nutshell , you have spent over 38 years of service to the station and you're still doing it , and that's why I love doing podcasting . I genuinely mean that , as I get to talk to inspiring leaders and patriots like yourself that are still out there trying to make a change . So kudos to you , and it's inspiring to see that .
Speaker 3Yeah , I appreciate it . You know some people when they retire ,
38 Years of Service: Troxell's Journey
Speaker 3you know the average sergeant major wants to play golf right as hardly go hunting , fishing or gardening . I don't do any of that stuff . You know , I like being around people , I like doing things that help people out , and my wife and I still like to do things , Even after 40 years of marriage . We like to dance , we like to karaoke and have some adult beverages , stuff like that . So we're kind of off the beaten path a little bit on how we live our lives . But it's all about what we can do to help others .
Speaker 2Yeah , so kind of transitioning before we really start digging into your leadership journey . We'll just start off with the top of , if you could define leadership in your terms and I'm really excited for your definition because I've had General Petraeus on and I've had other really outstanding leaders , but I don't think I've ever had a non-commissioned officer to literally the highest rank that you could possibly be on . So I'm interested to see how you would define leadership .
Speaker 3So I define leadership as an art , but it's about executing what I call the three Ps . It's your presence as a leader , it's your performance as a leader and your persistence as a leader . Presence meaning not just are you at the right place at the right time or are you at the points of friction . It is what happens to the troops when you show up as a leader . Do you have a certain charisma about you ? Do you have a certain energy ? Are you about vision , about purpose , about positivity that is infectious to your subordinates , that wants them to be around you ? And then performance is about whatever you expect the men and women to do in your charge . Then you ought to be doing it with them .
Speaker 3And that's not just the daily grind and everything , but it's the inherent danger of combat . You know , if the troops are exposed to that , then the leader better be out there with them . And it's also enduring and living in hardships . We shouldn't have leaders living in a five-star hotel when their troops are in dang shelter halves and stuff . Now I'm dating myself with the shelter halves , you know , in Kent City or whatever you know .
Speaker 3And then the persistence is actually mastering the art and the balance of the humanity aspect , which is empathy and compassion , with the discipline and accountability that is necessary to be productive , excuse me , and effective in your war fighting tasks . And that's where a lot of leaders struggle with is balancing war fighting tasks , and that's where a lot of leaders struggle with is balancing . Sometimes we have leaders that are over empathetic and over compassionate and not enough discipline and accountability , and it creates a sense of entitlement in the troops . And then you have that on the other side , that are you know way into the discipline and accountability , but a little light on the humanity side , and you potentially have a toxic environment on your hand when , and that creates a sense of fear and people don't want to work and they don't want to come to work , they don't want to be part of that team . So it's all about mastering leader presence , leader performance and leader persistence .
Speaker 2That is one thing I would love to dig in right there . How did you learn to balance that ? So when I first started off as a brand new lieutenant not a noncommissioned officer I quickly navigated towards my noncommissioned officer brothers because they taught me the right way to lead and I've been extremely lucky that I have had phenomenal noncommissioned officers really throughout my entire career and especially when I was a brand new platoon leader and then when I was a company commander . Twice I had phenomenal first sergeants , but each one had like their own distinct way of holding people accountable , like , hey , here's the standard , but we as leaders are above that standard , but we hold everyone to this standard . But you do it in such a way to where it doesn't belittle someone , where they feel less but they feel almost inspired in a way to get up to your level and the organization's level . How did you learn to do that , to balance those two ?
Speaker 3So what's interesting , you know , joining the Army in 1982 and serving through almost the entirety of the 80s and the 90s , when I was brought in we were very heavy on the discipline and accountability aspect and a little light on the humanity side , the empathy and compassion you know . So here I am . I want to get married . I hadn't been in the unit , hadn't been in the Army , but just a year and I wanted to get married to my wife , sandra . And you know I had noncommissioned officers telling me well , if the Army wanted you to have a wife , they would have issued you one .
Speaker 3Ok , you know , you know the deal , the story . So I was groomed to be this guy . That was all about discipline and accountability and , you know , always have an inflection in your voice to you know , and stuff like that . But as I continued to grow , I knew to have a cohesive team I had to have buy-in from the men and women in my organization and I had to not just have discipline , I needed self-discipline out of them , meaning they owned it and they wanted to be a part of that team .
Speaker 3So I had to really get after the you know the human side of it and everything . Now some people that serve with me and don't get me wrong , I love my soldier so much in combat that I refuse to pass by a deficiency without fixing it , especially when it came to being ready to fight , not having ballistic eye . Pro on not having , you know , no-max gloves . You know having their sleeves rolled up when they have a flame retardant shirt on . You know things like not knee pads around their ankles when you're taking a knee in gravel and your knee pads around your ankle , it kind of defeats the purpose . So I was very hard on that kind of stuff because I wanted my troops to be best prepared to fight and win on the worst day of their life . Not just survive but thrive , fight and win . And so sometimes you have to , you know , put the pedal on discipline and accountability . But the more I grew up , the more I grew as a leader . I knew I had to get after that humanity aspect and sometimes leaders have a hard time doing that because they think I'm supposed to be the one that keeps people in line . But I didn't just want to be that guy that was knife edging the troops . I wanted to have a cohesive team that was in a band of excellence and that we were the best at what we were doing . And I remember , as a platoon sergeant in 1992 to 95 in Schweinfurt , germany , my platoon leader , as a matter of fact , I was just on the phone with a guy about two hours before this . We still stay in touch and we wanted to be the best at what we did . We wanted to be the best at marksmanship . We wanted to be the best at PT , the best at gunnery . Not because , you know , we wanted . We were these arrogant pricks that wanted to , you know , just talk crap to everybody else , cause we knew if we got our troops into this band of excellence , we had to go to war . Then we had a competitive advantage over the enemy . And this was the 90s now , when we were a peacetime military . And I'm making my guys wear body armor in the field , which was unknown , making them wear camouflage paint in the field , you know , outside the 82nd Airborne Division , then no other unit . I was in the 3rd Infantry Division and people are like , why are you wearing camouflage paint on armored vehicles and everything ? I said , well , you know , during operation , just cause I had a guy get shot in the face , not my . There was a , a soldier that was shot in the face from the fifth mech uh division because he didn't have camouflage paint on and he had a kevlar or a boat , you know , the cvc helmet on and he got shot in the face by a PDF sniper . So that , to me , told me there's a reason to do all of these things .
Speaker 3So again , it goes back to why did I care about this stuff ? Because I loved the troops . And when you love them like that , then you're going to , you're going to make sure they're straight , you're going to give them to just like your children . You're going to , you're going to make sure they're straight , you're going to give them to , just like your children , you're going to give them tough love . But I didn't want it to be tough love . I wanted to love tough meaning . I wanted to show them that I loved them by treating them like human beings and everything . Uh , but you know , letting them know that we are going to have tough standards and discipline and performance , so that we are at the peak operating capability when the balloon went up .
Speaker 2I love that and I genuinely believe if you can convey that to a team like , hey , you want to be part of this team , this is the standard that you have to meet . But I will also be at that standard Absolutely . And it took me so long to kind of realize that and as I , as I mature and I wish I could go back in time and be a company commander again , because I would have been a way better company commander .
Speaker 3Yeah , absolutely , and you hit it on the head . That goes back to that performance . You know I didn't want any , any of my troops to have to do something that I wasn't willing to do myself or wasn't going to do with them . You know , and even as the SEAC , you know , at the pinnacle , general Dunford and I you know Marine General Joe Dunford , my boss we did the Army 10-miler and the Marine Corps Marathon every year . We did every services fitness test . You know why did we do that ? Because we thought we would be hypocritical if we are the senior officer and senior alerted guy in the DOD and we weren't doing what we expected every soldier , sailor , airman , marine guardian and Coast Guardsman to do . So I think that goes back to that leading by example and if you're willing to do it , it goes a long way with the troops , as you know , when the leader is out there doing the hard stuff with them .
Speaker 2Yeah , 100 percent . That's what motivates people especially . I remember when we were doing a lot of our brigade level live fires or I had the honor Some would say the worst job in the Army , but I thought it was the best job , as I was a JRTC instructor for two years and I saw , I think , 28 different rotations and I saw the good , the bad and the ugly of what command teams did . But the one common theme that I learned is airborne units typically did the best , but really it was about their leaders . Their leaders were enthusiastic . When the suck increased they showed up even more present and even more cheerful and even more enthusiastic Like hey , it's raining , we have to dig foxholes . Great , the ground is soft , so it's a good day .
Speaker 3Absolutely yeah . And I think back to that . You know that vision , purpose and positivity as a leader . If you know where you're going as a leader
Defining Leadership: The Three Ps
Speaker 3, you know where your organization is going . Now , certainly , it's the commander and the platoon leader that provide vision for the organization , but I think every leader has to have a vision of where they want to get to .
Speaker 3And then purpose why are we doing this ? And it's not so much that we're doing sucky stuff , it's not so much that we're doing sucky stuff , it's that we remember why we're doing it . And it's to make us better and ready to fight and win in combat . And then you already mentioned it , joshua positivity in everything we do , regardless of how bad it sucks , okay , let's get after it , and let's be positive on how we're going to get after things . You know , and you know , you know the old story . You always find some ways to you know in a positive manner , to make light of what you're doing . Like you know it's raining , you got to dig foxholes and everything .
Speaker 3And then I used to spin it on how to , you know , make it not suck . You know , like I would tell people hey , we're getting ready to . You know we're in combat , we're getting ready to . You know , walk up the Hindu Kush and I'll tell you this ounces equals pounds , pounds equals pain .
Speaker 3So you're going to take your necessary ammunition , you're going to wear your body armor and your sappy plates , you're going to have your communication systems , you're going to have water and you're going to have a ration to take with you , but anything else is a luxury . Now , if you want to haul it , god bless you . You can carry it , but the more we go up that steep pass hill , the more it's going to suck , and I've seen plenty of troops that start punting stuff going up there . You know so kind of use a positive spin off of something that sucked to get people to . You know , learn how to be better at their craft , and certainly you know foot marching up the Hindu Kush is a piece of the craft that you got to be good at , or that mountain can snap you off .
Speaker 2Yeah , that is a forcing function . For sure is that you're going to learn real quick , if you packed your bag correctly , and what is actually mission critical . I don't need this now , absolutely so kind of transitioning through your military career . I would love to hear it , because I did some research on you and I haven't really quite heard why you decided to join the military . What was that story of you wanting to actually serve ?
Speaker 3So I grew up , you know , you know my father ended up going to prison , you know , for some things that he did and my mom and him got divorced and I really never had purpose , motivation or direction till my mom remarried . My stepfather , ben , was a huge , you know , mentor to me , you know , and everything . But I was looking for something to be , you know , find my purpose , you know , and the direction I wanted to go . And where I grew up at , back in Davenport , iowa , the military was always around to go and , as I saw some of the older kids in my neighborhood that would join the military my brother Tom being one of them , but others , when they left , they were , like me , still wandering aimlessly and gallivanting around the streets at night and everything . But when they came back from their bootcamp , their basic training , ait or whatever , from their bootcamp , their basic training , ait or whatever , they were sinewy , muscular , they walked with their chest out , their head held high , they talked boisterously , they were more confident and I was like I don't know what drug they were feeding them there , but I want some of that and so that was kind of my motivation to join in how others were coming back and in such a better place .
Speaker 3I knew this that I wasn't a good athlete . I didn't have the grades to go to college . My family couldn't afford it . So I knew when I hit , when I graduated high school , I needed to do something . And if I would have stayed in my hometown I probably would have done nothing and gotten in trouble . And so the minute I joined the military and I got into it , I knew I had made the right decision . I didn't know at the time that it was going to be a 38-year career . I initially was going to do four years but met my wife Sandra . We expected our first child married . Now , I had family responsibilities and I knew that in order to best take care of my family , I needed to be the best soldier I could be , so promotions would come faster and opportunities would come up . So that's kind of what I did , you know , and that was the motivation to join and the motivation to stay in . And once I started becoming an NCO and had responsibility again , I just absolutely loved it .
Speaker 3And then being a paratrooper in the 82nd Airborne Division and all the opportunities that came with it and you spoke about it the esprit de corps , the camaraderie , you know the second that done , you know yeah , and and the , the alpha male kind of attitude there , even out of the females , you know it was an alpha , you know , and it was a division full of piranha and if you were a goldfish coming in there you were going to get eaten up in a hurry .
Speaker 3And so that's what kind of propelled my career to move forward , to move forward . And then having two combat tours there with Just Cause and Desert Storm , where I finally got to see firsthand all of the combat training paying off in real time in combat , that just propelled me even more to continue to keep going and being my best and everything . And I will tell you as happy as I am that I've served 14 years in the 82nd . I just got word about a month ago that at All-American Week this week , next month , I'll be inducted into the 82nd Airborne Division Hall of Fame . So you know , just an honor that I never thought I would get , that is being bestowed upon me . I'm completely humbled by that .
Speaker 2Well , I mean , no one is better deserving than you . That Well , I mean , no one is better deserving than you .
Speaker 3When is that ? In May , all-american Week , it's the . The ceremony is on the 22nd of May , so it's the 23rd of May . Now that , yeah , the 20th is the division run . And they asked me if I wanted to run it and I said you done , got the last click out of junior . Okay , I'll be at the last click out of junior . Okay , I'll be at the finish line rooting everybody on . You know I can still get after it , but I know how Pat Work is the division commander and you know four miles and 36 minutes is what the standard is , but on Pat Work's watch that might be four miles and 32 minutes , and so I'll be more than happy to , you know , be at the finish line rooting everybody on .
Speaker 2That's amazing , and I asked that question is because I'll be down that brag . And if it would , it would be funny if it was the exact same week , or Liberty . I'm never going to get used to saying that .
Speaker 3Yeah , you know , I will tell you . I got it . I know why the names were changed and everything , but I spent 14 years there and never once , I mean , I had soldiers , you know , that were African-American , asian , hispanic , you know , caucasian . Never once did I have a soldier in 14 years come up and say I'm offended by the name of this base , all right . So when they changed the names and everything I just told the paratroopers of the 82nd Airborne Division focus on who you are and what you are , don't focus on the name of the base . You are a paratrooper in America's Guard of Honor , the 82nd Airborne Division . Focus on that . Or you know the former Fort Hood , now Fort Cavazos . Don't be focused on that .
Speaker 2You're on America's first team , first Calvary division . You know , focus on that , you know , and so , yeah , I got it . So that's how I told people to on what you can control within your sphere of influence and just show up every day and be the best leader and best version of yourself that you can . Yeah , and I know when you , when you went to 82nd that was a transition between E7 to E8 . Did you have to go to Ranger school before you could be a first sergeant ? When did you go to raid your school ? Because I knew it was a little bit later in your career .
Speaker 3Yeah , I initially went to the 82nd in 1987 as an E-5 . And I was there 87 to 92 as an E-5 , e-6 . Went to Germany for three years . I came back in 95 as a platoon sergeant , again E-7 . But when I got there , you know , I was a 19 series guy .
Speaker 3So we were in the third of the 73rd Armor Battalion so there was no kind of rules and regulations like the infantry had about you know , being range of qualified as a platoon sergeant and a platoon leader or things like that . But when I came back , you know my first tour there for five years , you know the 80 , the old Ranger handshake , you know , and they'd shake your hand , they'd look at your left shoulder to see if you had a Ranger tab , you know , and then if you didn't have that tab , well then you're kind of a second class citizen . So when I came back in 95 , I said you know what ? Because my first five years I was there I focused on being a jump master and everything . And then on my way back I went to Pathfinder School . So I said this is my last opportunity , I want to go to Ranger School . So I was a Sergeant , first Class when I finally went to Ranger School in 1996 .
Speaker 3And what sucked about being a senior NCO going there is . I was the admin first sergeant from day one to day 40 , and the best thing that ever happened to me is at the end of the mountain I got fired . So because in Darby , if one more ranger student would have pissed and moaned about that Connex getting in their duffel bag and getting dry clothes because you know the deal , I mean people would have pissed and moaned about that Connex getting in their duffel bag and getting dry clothes Because you know the deal . I mean people , lollygag and everything , and next thing , you know you're getting smoked by the RIs and everything .
Speaker 3But I wanted to make sure that you know again , leading by example . I had the opportunity to go , went and graduated and came back . What that did do , though , is when the armor battalion deactivated and there was only one ground reconnaissance troop in the 1st and 17th Cav . There I interviewed with three other E-8s and I was the only Ranger , and I got selected by the Division CSM to be the 1st Sergeant over there there , and so that's what helped me stay in the division for two more years as a first sergeant , because I had gone to ranger school being a master rated parachutist with a combat jump star helps too , you know , but that was the bottom line . So yeah , I was 32 years old when I went to ranger school .
Speaker 2So I went through ranger school as a second lieutenant so I was super motivated and we're coming out of eyeball and I was basically told , if you don't get your ranger tab because I was going to a unit that was deploying , you are not going to lead troops in combat .
Speaker 2So I had this burning desire that , you know , hell or high water , I was going to get my ranger tab
Becoming a Command Sergeant Major
Speaker 2and you know , 90 days later I loved Florida so much I decided to do it a second time . I ended to lead troops in combat and seeing my peers that had that , but also seeing leaders who didn't have that . And I'm not saying a ranger tab makes or breaks someone I don't think it does . But within that setting it sets the standard . Are you able to meet that standard that you're going to ask men and women to do now ? Because at the end of the day , ranger school there's nothing crazy about it , right ? It's fundamental patrolling tactics at the individual , squad and platoon and company level and you have to master those . I like to think of it's like a master's degree in patrolling .
Speaker 3Absolutely . Yeah , it is the Army's toughest leadership school , because all of the tasks you're expected to do are basic tasks but you're starving , you haven't had any sleep and you got a bunch of tired . You know ungrateful assholes . You're trying to get into an effective fighting organization to be successful and that's what makes it tough , because the art of influence and leadership is alive and well there , because everything else is basic . I mean basic patrolling and stuff like that , basic raid , ambush , recon , that kind of stuff .
Speaker 3What's interesting , when I graduated in 1996 , the folks that I went to Ranger school like one of the guys is a guy named Kendall Clark who's now a brigadier general and he's the assistant division commander for operations in the 10th Mountain Division .
Speaker 3He was a second lieutenant , you know , and I had a me being a sergeant first class and I had a bunch of second lieutenants . You know there was a lot of informal mentorship I had to do , you know , like the big second lieutenant football player straight out of Ibolik , and we're in the patrol base building our fighting positions and everything , and all of a sudden I smell a turkey tuna with noodles and this dude is over there in England tuna with noodles when we're supposed to be working and I'm like , hey , dude 86 , the freaking chow , and get your ass over here . And of course the RI smelt the chow . We got our bag smoked for that . So hey , but it was all good . You know , I mean water resupply . I remember so many . You know stories from that and everything . But that shows you and , as a matter of fact , kendall Clark and I are very close to this day and it all became because we're in the same squad in Ranger School together and now he's a general officer , so good times .
Speaker 2I knew he was going places so I served under him . I was the HHC company commander in 2-2 infantry and when I I think he was getting ready to transition out when I was leaving . But a phenomenal leader and he actually put me in for I call it the Dougie back there behind me the Douglas MacArthur Award and I had the privilege of representing Force Comm as the representative from the 10th Mountain Infantry Division . But he was a phenomenal leader and it's funny that you went to ranger school with him . That's a small world .
Speaker 3Yeah , it is , yeah , but . But you know . But to your point about ranger school , and you're right , it's not the end all be all , but you know , the people that criticize it the most are the ones that either went and failed or you know , and so I think you gain a greater appreciation from that 67 days or the extended scale , like you did , you know , down in Florida .
Speaker 2Yeah , I had to work on my fitness .
Speaker 3In the end , I just I was . I was over in Europe with the second strike , your cavalry regiment , on Thursday and there was a young second lieutenant there I was talking to . He had spent six months in ranger school . He had recycled every phase and I said you know something , sir ? I want you to look at your ranger tab and look at this guy's over here . What's the difference between them ? Nothing , they're the same tab . It just you decided to stay , you know , six months instead of the normal two and a half months . And so , in the end , graduation is the key . Getting across the finish line is the key , and that's what I continue to tell people is don't worry about if you recycle or whatever , or if you have to come home because you failed a critical task . Fix that and go back . I mean , you can always go back , as long as you don't quit on anything . You know you're fine .
Speaker 2A hundred percent , so kind of transitioning back into your career . You get through that rank of first sergeant . When was the decision point that you decided that you were going to stay in the army for the long haul ?
Speaker 3Well , I think it really hit me . I think you start , you know , looking instead of down and in , you start looking up and out . And for me it was at the Sergeant First Class position , especially in Germany at the time , because you know , as I was a young NCO in heavy units , you know my 670-1 , my leadership manual , that kind of stuff is what I focused on . But when I became a platoon sergeant in Germany of a scout platoon , the number one thing that I carried with me was my unit attack SOP , sop , and it was about how do we perfect our battle drills , our war fighting tasks , our missions that we are expected to do in combat . And this was after I had my experiences in combat with the 82nd in Just Cause and Desert Storm . And then , as I started looking up and out , what were adjacent units doing , what was my higher headquarters doing , I wanted to deliver the why to the troops on on why we were doing what we were doing and the direction that our formation had us going .
Speaker 3And back then it was Kosovo and and the former Yugoslavia breaking up and stuff like that and the opportunity that we may end up having to go and fight there , which eventually we sent troops there , but I had already left and gone back to the 82nd .
Speaker 3But that's what there propelled me , that this is what I want to do . Because the more and more responsibility I got , the more infectious it became to me . And when I was having an impact on 30 troops as a platoon sergeant , I wanted 120 troops as a first sergeant and then I wanted 500 as a sergeant major . It was just I wanted to have that much more of an impact and and I told myself , as long as the Army will let me to continue to serve and as long as my family is happy , I'm going to continue to serve , and as long as my family is happy I'm going to continue to serve . And never did I think I would spend 38 years , but the more the opportunities came , the more I wanted to continue to serve . So I think at the Sergeant First Class rank is when I finally bought in that this is what I want to do for the rest of my life , you know , or the rest of my career , and that's why I stayed so long the rest of my career and that's why I stayed so long .
Speaker 2Team , let's take a quick break from this episode and I want to share an additional leadership resource with you , and that is one-on-one leadership coaching through McMillian Leadership Coaching . So what do I do ? I help leaders discover their purpose , create a long-term growth plan and take inspired action . I believe everything rises and falls on leadership and , regardless of where you are in life , one fact is true you are a leader of others , you are a leader of your family and , most importantly , you are a leader of yourself . To lead others well , that starts by leading yourself well . If you want to learn more , you can go to wwwMcMillianLeadershipcoachingcom and schedule a free call today .
Speaker 2Back to the episode when you transitioned into being a command sergeant major . What was that role like for you ? Because I know each one of the ranks , at least from an officer's side . I had to learn to delegate more , stretch myself more , give more power away , if that makes sense , because the tasks are more demanding . So if I'm going to be successful the team's going to be successful then that means I need to empower my team , give them more tools , give them more authority , mission command . At the end of the day . That's what I need to actually practice , but from your lens , as you grew , what made you successful at that key developmental rec . Because there's not that many people .
Speaker 3Yeah , I think , first and foremost , what I did , and I think to be an effective command sergeant major , you have to go in with your commander , understand the commander's vision , what their priorities are , and then where do they see your role ? And then you have a conversation on that . Okay , and what ? For me , I would ? What's your vision , sir ? What are the priorities ? I understand what we as a squadron or a battalion are expected to do in combat . I know what our mission . Essential tasks are for the organization , but I would take all of that in based off . The tasks are for the organization , but I would take all of that in , based off the commander's vision and priorities , and I would develop focus areas that would complement my commander and then provide them the pulse of the force from me as the command sergeant major . But more importantly , because I understood the direction the commander had us going and what we were expected to do , it was elite easier for me to deliver the why to the troop and you know , uh , joshua , when the troops know why they're doing something , how long they have to do it and what it's supposed to look like when they're done , regardless of how much it sucks , or look like when they're done , regardless of how much it sucks or how dangerous the combat is , they'll get after it and they'll go after it in a precise military manner to get the job done . But it's when they don't know . You know the why and I always hear leaders say , well , I don't have time to say why . I said we give the why all the time in our operations orders . You know , in our mission statement we provide the who , what , where , when and why . You know , when we give a task out , we give a task and purpose , the why . And so , as a command sergeant major , that's what I focused on , you know , giving feedback to the commander on their vision and priorities and the direction the organization was going , and then delivering to the troops the why . And I did that through my kind of leader focus , my first sergeants and platoon sergeants , focusing one and two levels down so that I wasn't micromanaging .
Speaker 3Some command sergeant majors think they come in and they're the savior of Joe , you know , and that's exactly the wrong way to go about business . All right , the troops have a team leader , a squad leader , they got a platoon sergeant and a platoon leader and everything . So your job as the CSM is to mentor one and two levels down , just like commanders do one and two levels down . You know battalion commanders , mentor platoon leaders as well as company commanders , so , and as you go up , it's still that way .
Speaker 3So that's what I focused on having good leader development programs for my inner circle you know my first sergeants and platoon sergeants and getting after the vision and priorities of the commander through developed focus areas that I came up with , that I shared with the commander , to make sure we were in sync with the direction we were going . And then around all of that was the commander and I leading by example . In everything we did , whether it was PT , whether it was living in the field , whether it was doing marksmanship , whether it was doing hand-to-hand , whatever we were doing , you know it was leading through our example .
Speaker 2I think leading by example is one of the most powerful things . At the end of the day , leaders have to be effective at communicating , and I love how you talked about delivering the why , because that's the theme that I'm seeing . And if you go back to ADP 6-22 , purpose , direction , motivation , the definition of leadership In my mind . Purpose is that why , and to effectively communicate to someone , you have to take the time to explain why they're doing that , not just at the tactical level , but also like strategic level .
Speaker 2I remember being in Afghanistan , Nalgam , doing some patrols around there , and to the guys they're like why are we going out here and walking around this desert trying to get shot at ? Well , and that's when the actual votes were going to take place in Afghanistan and what we were trying to do was to disrupt the Taliban from influencing that voting pattern . And all , by the way , we were right where Mullah Omar created the heart of the Taliban in Nalgum . So when I showed that to them and I could explain it to them , you could see a pep in their step Like all right , I'm actually out here and I'm doing great Thanks .
Speaker 3Yeah , absolutely , I will tell you . Even . You know , I went to visit some of our elite Navy , our most elite Navy , special operators , in Somalia when I was the SEAC . And as I got off the you know the rotator plane to get there , the squadron commander for that SEAL unit said hey , how does this end ? I said , well , what do you mean , Sorry ? He said , all right , you know I'm here doing you know , counterterrorist , counterinsurgent kind of stuff , but how is this thing supposed to end ? What direction are we going here in this country ? So I understand how we fit in with the foreign policy for the country and how our combat actions are going to support that foreign policy .
Speaker 3And I learned then , even at the strategic level , when I was representing the chairman of the Joint Chief of Staff and Secretary of Defense in my travels , I had to deliver the why . And the more I did that , the more people were like , wow , okay , I got it , We'll get after that and everything . So you're exactly right , Whether it's tactical , operational , strategic , the troops have to know why they're doing something . What's the purpose ?
Speaker 2And then you know as much as possible what's the end state when we get done here . Yeah , I love how you talked about that before , because you hit the nail on the head pulse of the force At the end of the day . Even in your time as the senior enlisted advisor like that's what you did you were the pulse of the , not just the army but all of DOD . So I got to hear the story of how E-Tool Nation started .
Speaker 3OK . So this all started when Secretary Mattis was sworn in by President Trump as
The E-Tool Nation Story
Speaker 3the secretary of defense , and it was on a Friday in January of 2017 , he got sworn in and his first engagement on Monday morning was breakfast with myself and the service senior enlisted , so Dan Daly , the Sergeant Major of the Army , ron Green , sergeant Major of the Marine Corps , and the others' services , and the first thing when we showed up that morning . I showed up a few minutes early and the secretary called me and he said , hey , have you read your charter ? And I said I have , mr Secretary , and he says well , you advise me , as well as the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff . And I said , roger , that he said so when I tell you to , I want you to pack your stuff . You're going with me , with me . I said , roger that , and then he told me he said something that morning you know to the media , and he said we're not going to talk about defeating the enemies of the United States . We are going to annihilate any threat to the United States . And I thought that was powerful , because that's a message that commanders like you and troops and leaders all over the world want to hear . They don't want to hear , you know , some remark , like we're talking about one of our enemies , like we're talking to toddlers , okay . And so he told me , get the word out . And he told myself and the service senior enlisted to get the word out about annihilation . And the more I got around Secretary Mattis and , you know , being around General Dunford , who were two of the most phenomenal leaders I ever served with , I knew , as I was delivering the why to the troops , that I needed to echo their themes and messages .
Speaker 3And so I happened to be in Syria with our most elite Army Special Operations Unit and I was there for the fight in Raqqa and I'm up on a roof of a building with the guy that's in charge of the fight as a matter of fact , the main effort for the lasting defeat of ISIS and the guy in charge of the fight was a dang Master Sergeant , promotable from our most elite army special operations organization and it was him and his fire support guy , who was another master sergeant up there , that was just bringing Royal Scunion on ISIS as the Syrian democratic forces were moving in contact . But anyway , so I'm up there and I'm also up there the JSOC senior enlisted leader , the SOCOM senior enlisted leader and the unit sergeant major are up there with me on the roof of this building and we're watching this fight unfold . And every time there was a pause there would be a Mad Max looking vehicle-borne IED that would come out and would detonate on our SDF fighters and our special operations advisors . Special operations advisors or a female suicide bomber would come out and they were a very , very resilient enemy . And so , finally , I just said , you know what ? These assholes have two options . And and uh , I said they can surrender or die . You know , because we had been talking about that during this trip with some of the operators uh , a Sergeant major by the name of George , who's now retired , a really good friend of mine , I befriended him there . This is a guy that has spent 20 years in that unit , been wounded about six times , and so we were talking about leadership and combat and things like that , and we started talking about the E-Tool , you know , as a means of killing . You know whether it was whatever we needed to do to neutralize a threat , that there had to be some kind of nonstandard way . We did that .
Speaker 3So , anyways , I'm on the roof of this building and the unit sergeant major , a guy named Rob says to me so what do you mean by that ? I said , well , we're a peace loving people . Me . So what do you mean by that ? I said , well , we're a peace loving people . So if they surrender , we'll safeguard them to the detainee holding facility cell , give them three hots and a cot and we'll give them due process in a court of law . But let there be no doubt , if they choose not to surrender , then we're going to kill them with extreme prejudice , either by dropping bombs on them , shooting them in the face or , if need be , beating them to death with our entrenching tools . And he says you know , you ought to put that in your update to Secretary Mattis and General Dunford . So I did that night , when I sent my update to them and Mattis replied back in less than an hour and said keep saying that . That , you know , complements my annihilate any threat . And so I adopted that surrender or die kind of thing just to provide an inspirational message to the troops all over the world . You know that purpose , motivation , direction kind of thing . And it was never an issue with that until it was Christmas Day 2018 . With that , until it was Christmas day 2018 .
Speaker 3And I was on a USO tour with General Dunford and I'm in Cobb or , excuse me , bagram , in a theater or in a hangar and we've got all the troops there , we've got all the USO celebrities and everything , and my job was to fire the troops up before the celebrities came out and entertained and everything . So Dunford and I are on stage , he gives his opening message and he hands the mic to me and Medal of Honor recipient Flo Groberg is on the stage with me too , and Flo and I have entrenching tools in our hands . I had been saying this surrender or die speech everywhere . So I got up there and was really impassioned on how I said it and demonstrative with the E-tool , and the troops loved it . They went bananas .
Speaker 3But afterwards I was approached by a reporter from the Washington Post and he said to me hey , I can't believe . You just told the troops it was OK to go out and commit war crimes . I said I didn't do anything of the sort . We train soldiers , marines and battlefield airmen how to use nonstandard weapons to neutralize enemy threats . And he said well , hey , I'm going to go , I'm going to make this a big deal , I'm going to do an article about it and everything , because I think you're wrong . And I said knock yourself out , dude . And then , as he walked away , I thought about it again . I was like , oh shit , you know .
Speaker 3So I reached out to my public affairs guy at the time , that's Sergeant Rob Couture , who was back home in Fort Meade , maryland , unwrapping Christmas presents with his family , and I said , hey , this Washington Post guy says he's going to blow up the surrender or die stuff . He said let's beat him to the punch and take the air out of his story . So he asked me to send him a photo with me holding an e-tool and then he took the quote I had and he put it with that picture and we put it on social media on Facebook , twitter at the time , instagram , you know and put it out and it went viral . Okay , because I was using this language , talking about killing terrorists . And when I say viral , it was picked up by CNN . The Fox 5 did a show on it . You can you know YouTube and find that New York Times was bashing me . The German , belgian and French media picked it up , japanese and Korean media picked it up and everything . And all of a sudden , this thing went viral .
Speaker 3Now , in regards to the troops , they loved it . It was a message they wanted to hear . And I was getting messages from all over the world , from leaders , commanders , senior enlisted leaders saying thank you , we need to hear this message . But people in Washington DC didn't like it too well . Some , you know , senior officers were like who is this enlisted guy , you know , speaking out of school , you know ? And I even had a Navy three-star admiral come into my office and say you need to walk this back , you shouldn't be talking like that . And I said , hey look , secretary Mattis and General Dunford are okay with what I said . I'm echoing their themes . If you've got a problem , go talk to them . And he says to me you realize that enlisted are meant to be seen and not heard . Right , I was like , admiral , it's best that you leave my office or we can be some fighting MFers in here tonight , you know . But the landscape started changing on me in Washington DC and all of a sudden , long story short , it culminated in DC . And all of a sudden , long story short , it culminated . I was an IG .
Speaker 3Complaint was filed against me saying I was using torturous language , creating hostile and toxic conditions and everything else . And there was a few select people that I know that were involved in that One was a senior enlisted guy , another one was a general officer none of them in the army or the Marine Corps and uh , and so I was suspended for six months and you know , the first day I was feeling sorry for myself like geez I . I've been a leader , I've been a Sergeant major for 20 years and I've never had something like this happen to me . But then , after day one , I said you know what ? I'm not gonna . I not going to back down because people were telling me to retire and everything . And I said no . So I went into General Dunford and I said , sir , there's only two ways this thing has ended . You're either going to fire me and make me retire or you're going to reinstate me and put me back to work . I am not going to quit , because if I quit then it's okay for any other troop out there across the joint force to quit anytime they want to . So I stuck it out for six months and in the end , you know , I was held accountable for a couple of minor things , but I was reinstated . And when I finally got back into my office after six months , I told myself I am not going to change who I am as a leader , but I'm going to be more cognizant of my inner circle .
Speaker 3But the bottom line , what this did , joshua , and there's a Marine officer her name is Kimberly Sontag that I worked with . She was on the chairman's team , a very high speed Marine officer , and when I was reinstated I had so many congratulatory statements sent to me and people saying , hey , welcome back , and everything . And she sent a message . She put a message on Facebook with the story . While I was reinstated she said relax , america , he's back . And . And that just fueled me to that I did the right thing .
Speaker 3But what it did is because the minute I said that , using the entrenching tool , I was getting thousands of these e-tools sent to me or people coming by wanting me to sign them , and to this day I've signed over 6,000 of these things now and it took the entrenching tool from a multifunctional tool to now is a weapon of war and it's something . So what I did is , you know , to put a positive spin on it , and I made eTool Nation my nonprofit and what I do to to give back . Uh , I I have , you know , I'm a huge sports guy and I have three veteran athletes that I sponsored through eTool Nation One mixed martial artist , one female world record strong woman and power lifter and a bodybuilder , and so I use it in positive ways now to get after it . And in the end I wrote my memoir , you know , and the title of it is Surrender or Die Reflect reflections of a combat leader . So I tried to spin this into a direction that people could look at what I went through and could be inspired by it and everything . But I will tell you this and I'll end this story with this If I didn't have a leader like Marine General Joe Dunford , that was going to allow the process to work its way through and was going to stand by me to the end , I wouldn't have been there .
Speaker 3I will tell you , there are leaders in our ranks , senior leaders , that would not have the intestinal fortitude to stand by their sergeant major , their senior enlisted leader like Dunford did and then , in the end , reinstate me and put me back to work . Did and then , in the end , reinstate me and put me back to work . I've seen several instances where commanders and senior officers have said you know , well , I've got to send a statement to the big army or whatever , and they , you know , have lost faith and confidence in their senior listed and they send them down the road . So I am grateful that I had a boss like Joe Dunford and a boss like Jim Mattis that never lost , never wavered in what I was doing , you know , and readily put me back to work .
Speaker 2I think we need more leaders like that , who choose the hard rights over the easy wrongs . Now and it's unfortunate because I'm a major now but I'm seeing more field grade officers , I'm spending more time and it's so political it really is above those ranks and I just miss being around soldiers and then helping
Life After Service
Speaker 2make a positive impact . And I definitely understand , you know , working at the Pentagon as the senior enlisted advisor to the chairman and just being surrounded with people who necessarily aren't of the same opinion of you and they're always looking for a little chink in the armor that they can potentially exploit . And having leaders like that that are willing to go to bat to you is makes the difference . So that's amazing . So transitioning out , what was that like ? 38 years in the military and then one day you're a civilian ?
Speaker 3So I knew this was the end of the road . I couldn't go any higher in the enlisted ranks . So when I assumed the duties , as a matter of fact , the Army had to give me an extension to go beyond 35 years to serve . And when they sent me the letter that approved my extension , they said your extension is approved , but be advised , no more . No other extension will be authorized . This is your terminal assignment . So you know , I didn't need that letter to tell me that this was my terminal assignment , but I knew it , that letter to tell me that this was my terminal assignment . But I knew it .
Speaker 3So I never , you know , prepared myself Mentally . I knew I was coming down and I was going to be retiring , but I never went through the steps to get ready . So I was kind of behind the power curve . Thankfully , I had a great staff that helped me out . But I wasn't going to look back , josh . I was going to continue to look forward , and so I welcomed that . I was leaving , all right , because I had reached the pinnacle of the enlisted ranks . I had served for almost 38 years and I was ready to go and see what I could do next , you know , and I wanted to spend more time with my family and everything and I think you never lose selfless service . And had General Milley asked me to extend , I probably would have you know . There was talk that he was going to ask me to extend , but I was ready to go and when I left I told the guy coming behind me , cz Colon Lopez , my good friend . I said here's my cell phone number , brother , but I don't want yours because if you need me you can call me , but I'm not going to be calling you and checking up on you . You're the SEAC .
Speaker 3Now I'm a retired guy , and so I focused on what I could do next and I wanted to , you know , give back , pay it forward , but make life comfortable for my family . I wanted to take on the corporate world and so I've done that for the last four years and I've had some investments that have tanked on me . You know a couple of them one just recently that's got me out of tens of thousands of dollars . But I've had plenty more that have really worked out for me , and my ability to consult for several businesses has made life comfortable for us . But , more importantly , I have the same purpose that I had on active duty , although I'm looking at it from a different angle . I mean , I have no problem walking out of a shop at on post , and if Joe ain't got his headgear on pumping gas , I walk by it . Yeah , hey , not my business anymore , you know . Plus , if I did walk up with a retiree ID card to the kid , he probably knows that I have zero authority and he'd either tell me to F off or beat my ass right there at the gas pump .
Speaker 3So so I focus on what I can do and and the direction that we're going , and my wife Sandra and I you know , as I said before , we've been together over 40 years . We constantly talk about how much longer I'm going to do this . Initially , we were on a five-year plan , but things were going so well we gave ourselves an extension and we're going to do this . Initially , we were on a five-year plan , but things were going so well we gave ourselves an extension and we're going to keep doing things and keep giving back and keep trying to make life comfortable so that we can .
Speaker 3We have changed the economic trajectory for our families to where now we can provide a future for our grandchildren that they wouldn't have ordinarily had , and it all comes from me joining the army and then meeting her in El Paso , texas , and getting married , and then here's where we are now . So the transition wasn't rough for me because I was looking forward , and I will tell you I am perfectly happy being a retired guy that still gets the chance to go out and PT with the troops , or , you know , come and speak to them . Or , like I said last week , spending a week in Europe visiting with troops at RAF Mildenhall in the UK and Vilsack , stuttgart and Ramstein in Germany . And so I'm a happy camper and life is good .
Speaker 2Some of those companies that you founded when you got out was definitely eTool Nation , a nonprofit , it's a PME .
Speaker 3PMEhardcom . You know , physically , mentally and emotionally hard . It's kind of it was my motto . You know this gets back to you know , sucking it up and driving on and being a champion , not a victim . And in order to be best effective we have to be physically , mentally and emotionally hard , not too strong or tough , but the exact opposite of soft . And so yeah , that too . And then you know I support the US Chambers nonprofit . Yeah , that too . And then you know I , I support the U S chambers nonprofit .
Speaker 3I'm I'm an ambassador for Beaver fit USA ESSI , where downrange supplements , uh are supplements that are in every commissary , uh , in the , the defense commentary agency , uh also , uh , others . I have other sponsors and stuff too that I work with Muscle Mac Protein , enriched Macaroni and Cheese , nirvana Water and folks like that , and then Aditon Software , just to name a few of what I'm doing . And , like I said , I've got a leader development company with a guy named Tim Chachi-Pachesa called LEED L-E-9-D . You know , because we're two retired E-9s that talk about evolution . So life's good , and you know . And then I , you know I'm a published author too . So just in a really good spot now and just excited about what we do every day as a family , but , more importantly , what I do every day to assist the troops and veterans and their families every day to assist the troops and veterans and their families .
Speaker 2What drove you to write that book ? And also , too , if someone listening to this podcast wants to go find it .
Speaker 3What's the best place to find that book ? Yeah , they can find it on barnesandnoblecom or on Amazon , or they can go to my website , pmehardcom , to order it . So the e-tool Nation thing you know the whole eTool story and being suspended for six months . And then you know doing the combat jump and Operation Just Cause . Being a 38-year veteran , everybody was telling me . And then retiring as the SEAC , everybody's telling me hey , you got to write a book , you got to write a book , you got to tell your story because it's interesting . And so I .
Speaker 3It was never . I just didn't know how to get after it until I met a guy on a flight coming back from Tampa one day who was a published author , and he introduced me to well , he Googled me and he said have you thought about writing a book ? And I said , well , yeah , but I don't know how to get after it . So he linked me up with his author coach , a lady named Ann McIndoo who's been an author coach for thousands of authors , and she came together with me and she got my story out of my head onto paper and we went from concept to publishing in 90 days . That's how much she helped me 90 days , 90 days .
Speaker 2That gives me anxiety .
Speaker 3Well , I knew that if I prolonged it that I would procrastinate and it wouldn't have got done , and plus with my busy schedule and everything , I didn't want to have to deal with it on the road . So we got it done , got it published and the book is doing well . And the other thing is , you know , I'm now an expert analyst on a show on the History Channel called the Proof Is Out there Military Mysteries . You can catch it every Monday night at 10 Eastern time on the History Channel . I am one of about 20 expert analysts . My episodes haven't come on yet but they'll be coming soon . Now again , this is a show that is kind of off the beaten path for me , because they're asking me about military mysteries like Hitler's hidden gold in Poland and the nuclear weapon that almost went off in the 60s and in North Carolina and stuff like that and everything . But so yeah , I've got a lot of things going on and the book , like I said , barnes , noble , amazon or PMEhardcom .
Speaker 2So you're definitely definitely staying busy in retirement . I feel like we could have a whole other episode on just all of the extracurricular activities or serial entrepreneurship endeavors that you're doing . That's amazing and it's inspiring . It really is , Because I think that that is the heartbeat of this nation is veterans who get out and they continue to make this country the best country in the world , and I genuinely believe in believe that in the world and I genuinely believe in believe that it's time for our final show segment that I like to call the killer bees .
Speaker 1These are the same four questions that I ask every guest on the Tales of Leadership podcast Be brief , be brilliant , be present and be gone . Question one .
Speaker 2So what do you believe separates a good leader from an extraordinary leader ?
Speaker 3I believe it is being authentic and having a certain energy and enthusiasm about you and that is delivered in a positive way .
Speaker 2I love it . Question two what is one resource that you could recommend to our listeners ?
Speaker 3For leading .
Speaker 2For leadership , development , self-development , anything that's really helped you in your journey .
Speaker 3So I just recently became a John Gordon certified trainer and teacher of the power of positive leadership and the power of positive teams . So I would recommend people go to see . John Gordon has published almost 30 books . He's a leadership coach for Sean McVay of the Los Angeles Rams , eric Spolstra of the Miami Heat , several executives and everything . Go to read .
Speaker 3If you read any books and these his books are normally like 120 pages . You can read them on an airline flight . But if you read the Power of Positive Leadership , the Power of Positive Teams and the Energy Bus , those three books , I will tell you are very inspirational and they're off the beaten path , but in the end it's about leadership and they're off the beaten path but in the end it's about leadership , inspiration , building cohesive teams . And John has become a serious mentor for me in the times I've spent with him In the last two months . I got certified through him but also I've spent hours with him and you know when you look at where can I look for mentorship and everything , when you look at where can I look to for mentorship and everything , john Gordon is one of those guys .
Speaker 2I've never heard of any of those books . I read so many books in a year , so I'm really excited to dig into those three . All right , I'm breaking my rules . So question three is if you could give go back in time and give your younger self one piece of advice , what would it be and why ?
Speaker 3Patience and tolerance . Sometimes I would make rash decisions that I didn't have all the facts or that somebody had screwed something up that I didn't have full context on why they screwed it up , and I either thumped them pretty hard or I made a decision that really needed a little bit more process and everything . So patience and tolerance .
Speaker 2I love that . So question three how can ? Or question four how can our listeners find you and how can they add value to the missions that you're currently on right now ?
Speaker 3So you can find me my website , pmehardcom but I'm also on all social media , on Facebook . If you go to Facebook and Instagram and LinkedIn , make sure you get the right one , the John Wayne Troxel with the blue check mark , because I have hundreds of people that are impersonating me out there . But I'm on all social media and I am constantly posting about what I'm doing around my travels with the DOD . I was just down on the Southern border . The key thing people can find me on is my YouTube show , leader Talk . I'm on YouTube as well as Spotify and Apple Podcasts , but I go on there and I talk about raw , unauthentic leadership and people can watch my show .
Speaker 3The last show I did was about situational understanding and situational awareness and how we're lacking that in our country today and in our world and how that could potentially cause us to be an easy threat to terrorist attack or violent attacks . And I also talk about my recent visit to the southern border and spending time with our Customs and Border Patrol folks . So that's where people can find me at and again , like I said , the books on Amazon , barnes , noble , and everything that you want
Leadership Advice and Final Thoughts
Speaker 3to know about me is on my website , PMEhardcom to know about me is on my website , pmehardcom .
Speaker 2This has been an amazing podcast episode and I mean this is that I think I've taken over eight pages of notes and I didn't even get to half of the questions that I wanted to ask , but my wife would kill me if I spent more than an hour .
Speaker 3Hey Joshua , I appreciate one , your leadership and still serving , and everything but two , giving me the opportunity to come on here today , and I'd love to come back whenever you'd have me .
Speaker 2Absolutely . Thank you so much for being a guest .
Speaker 3Awesome , thank you .
Speaker 2All right , team , it is time for our after action review . So what are the top three takeaways that you should have from this episode and I always start it with you should have . What are the top three takeaways that you should have from this episode and I always start it with you should have ? These are the top three takeaways that I have pulled from this episode , and it's been a truly amazing episode with John Wayne Troxell because we talk about his amazing story , but some of the leadership lessons that he's learned and it's not lost on me of how humbling of an opportunity it is to talk to individuals like this , who have raised to the highest ranks that they possibly can in their chosen careers , and the stories and the themes that have helped them get there . So the first key takeaway that I got was his three definitions when it comes to leadership , and number one is presence . Number two is professionalism and number three is persistence . So we'll start there with presence . Presence is , as a leader , you always need to be positive , and he talks about this towards the end with John Gordon and the books that he goes into , but the power of being positive cannot be underestimated as a leader . Number two professionalism . At the end of the day , you are the leader . You are the face of the organization . You need to speak intelligently and you also need to know what you're talking about . You need to show up in the right place in the right uniform and look the part . That's part of being a leader . You have to be professional and in the military that also means holding yourself to the same standard physically that you would ask other soldiers to do . I would never ask my soldiers to go on a 12 mile ruck march , especially a 12 mile ruck march for an EIB , and not go with them , because at the end of the day , we are a professional fighting force , a professional organization , and we do things professionally . And I would always end that with my safety briefs at the weekend to think about hey , before you make a decision , understand that decisions have consequences and understand , at the end of the day , you are a professional soldier . And then the third key takeaway is persistence . At the end of the day , you are a professional soldier and then the third key takeaway is persistence . At the end of the day , leaders drive the ball forward , they move the organization forward , and I love those three basic definitions of leadership just instilled into one beautiful package .
Speaker 2And the second key takeaway and this one was the one that was most impactful for me was having a balance in leadership from being overly sympathetic and being overly hard and holding people to an extreme level of accountability . I was an infantry officer . I led individuals in combat . I've seen people freeze up when they were getting shot at , literally freeze up and not be able to return fire . In those moments you need to be on the far right side of the spectrum and hold people to extreme accountability because lives are on the line style approach . And I give those two left and right limits because , as a leader , it comes to discretion and I had to learn this the hard way . The world is not full of nails and you are not a hammer and you need to understand that , because it took me for a very long time to fully grasp that . So go into every situation with an open heart , an open mind , and figure out what is the best way to convey the message that you need .
Speaker 2And the last key takeaway that I have is it goes back to the definition of leadership and ADP 6-22 purpose direction , motivation . The first part is critical purpose Leaders explain the why If you are not explaining the why to your team . They are not going to put the level of work that you expect out of it . So take the time and clearly explain the why to why people are doing things . All right , team , if you enjoyed this podcast , do me a favor . Make sure you share it , make sure you rate it . Follow me on social media . Go to mcmillianleadershipcoachingcom . Look at all the additional leadership resources that I have for you . And the last one go be the leader that this world needs . As always , I'm your host , josh McMillian , saying every day is a gift . Don't waste yours . I'll see you next time . You .
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